Suspect in PlayStation 3 robbery killed

snkcube · Post by **snkcube** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 3:25 am

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061204/ap_ ... tion_theft

Oh boy...that sucks.

PHoNyMiKe · Post by **PHoNyMiKe** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 3:38 am

I don't see why they had to kick open the door and be shooting this dude and his dog. if some dude is being a hippy and raving about the patriot act, go ahead and taze him. but if someone is alleged to have thrown a beating over a couple ps3s I don't see why they had to bust into this dude's home and open fire. this one sounds like a legit police foulup.

these kids are stupid anyways. nobody ever got hurt over a nintendo wii, and twice as many have been sold than ps3.

Joe Camacho · Post by **Joe Camacho** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 3:52 am

Now that is police brutality. I wonder if the dog tried to attack them.

Echoecho · Post by **Echoecho** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 4:06 am

WHAT? That rocks. I'd only be sorry for his mother or parents, but he won't be missed otherwise. It was filth. God, if only I had a license to kill filth.

corronchilejano · Post by **corronchilejano** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 6:09 am

WHAT

THE

FUCK?!

Now that's a bitch... what kind of sick piece of crap shoots a guy for a console?... well, $1200 in consoles... well, up to $2500 in consoles... whatever, this is nuts!

SquareHead · Post by **SquareHead** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 7:41 am

HAHA PSown3d

Demios · Post by **Demios** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:31 am

Shooting dog = standard procedure or some shit. I'm just taking a guess, since you know, dogs arent going to listen to "freeze" or "you're under arrest"
Seriously though, What ever happened to "Freeze! Drop your weapon!" instead of "HES GOT A CONTROLLER OPEN FIRE"

Echoecho · Post by **Echoecho** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 10:04 am

I don't know but if that was the guy who stole the stuff he got what he deserved so fuck him.

Demios · Post by **Demios** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 10:37 am

Echoecho wrote:I don't know but if that was the guy who stole the stuff he got what he deserved so fuck him.

So the punishment for stealing is death? look I understand he assaulted someone. Death? I'm sorry but you are a fucking fool. No one deserves death unless their crimes are grave enough (rapists and murderers IMHO).

SquareHead · Post by **SquareHead** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:08 pm

Sorry for derailment, but is that a mini USB port on the back of that controller?

Nightcrawler · Post by **Nightcrawler** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 2:27 pm

OK, well I think we agree the police were probably in the wrong as long as they're not leaving out key details that we don't know about.

BUT.. I honestly think more of these types of incidents need to happen. Crime is just out of control in some areas of our country. Why is crime rate lower in other countries? One reason is they have much more strict consequences. In our country, you go to jail longer for intellectual property theft than you do for most crimes involving direct physical harm of somebody else. Something is wrong with that.

Who is going to go steal a PS3 if they know they will be gunned down by law enforcement for it? I bet many people would think twice about risking death. Those that don't, didn't value their life much to begin with. I would just like to cut down on the number of people that think it's ok to steal from you or I primarily because nothing is going to happen to them.

Hyos · Post by **Hyos** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:08 pm

Nightcrawler wrote:Who is going to go steal a PS3 if they know they will be gunned down by law enforcement for it? I bet many people would think twice about risking death. Those that don't, didn't value their life much to begin with.

I believe knowing you could be gunned down after stealing a console would stop some people, but it would also cause some people to wear bulletproof vests when stealing it and also make them carry guns to defend from the police chasing them. This is called escalation. The police wear bullet-proof vests, they buy armor-piercing rounds... Sure not any robber would do this. But nowadays you are threathened with a fist and a hit in your face if you don't give up your wallet. Do you like the thought of being threatened with a gun instead?

casualsax3 · Post by **casualsax3** » Tue Dec 05, 2006 10:01 pm

SquareHead wrote:Sorry for derailment, but is that a mini USB port on the back of that controller?

For charging and probably other fun stuff.

Echoecho · Post by **Echoecho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 2:33 am

Demios wrote:
Echoecho wrote:I don't know but if that was the guy who stole the stuff he got what he deserved so fuck him.
So the punishment for stealing is death? look I understand he assaulted someone. Death? I'm sorry but you are a fucking fool. No one deserves death unless their crimes are grave enough (rapists and murderers IMHO).

I'm a fucking fool yet you are arguing in favor of this guy without knowing the details? Were you there?

Here is what we know here.

The guy and his buddy beat someone up to steal expensive stuff.
The guy didn't answer his door when the police arrived.
The guy had a dangerous dog and allowed it to attack police.

Fuck.him. And who said anything about "punishment"? This was not a sentence handed to him. It was just an outcome. And caused by his own stupidity. Put yourself in the cops position. Do you want to get shot by some lowlife? The guy sends a dog, then he was probably hanging around with something in his hand, it was a controller. In a split second, what would you do?

I believe knowing you could be gunned down after stealing a console would stop some people, but it would also cause some people to wear bulletproof vests when stealing it and also make them carry guns to defend from the police chasing them. This is called escalation. The police wear bullet-proof vests, they buy armor-piercing rounds... Sure not any robber would do this. But nowadays you are threathened with a fist and a hit in your face if you don't give up your wallet. Do you like the thought of being threatened with a gun instead?

Plain dumb. People are robbed at gunpoint all the time.

Joe Camacho · Post by **Joe Camacho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 3:51 am

And I wonder Echoecho, WHERE YOU THERE?

Your "Points":
The guy and his buddy beat someone up to steal expensive stuff. Sure, that's a crime, and he should be processed by it, by a judge and a jury, and serve his sentence, NOT GET SHOT DOWN BY POLICE OFFICERS THAT THINK THAT A CONTROLLER IS A LETHAL WEAPON.

The guy didn't answer his door when the police arrived. Maybe he was taking a dump, or answering a phone call, hell, maybe he was trying to ace hole 18! So if someone knocks on your door and you don't open inmediately, it means that you can force entry and kill you? Fuck that. And we also ignore if they *told* the guy that they were the Police, they could have told him they had free pie for him, for all we know. Also, he had a ROOMMATE, couldn't he expected HE to open the door?

The guy had a dangerous dog and allowed it to attack police. A German Sheperd is a "dangerous dog" According to who? Also, we don't know if he really "allowed" it to attack. And even if he did, you don't KILL someone for damages caused by your pets.

What we DO know about the article is:

They shot the dog down. - We don't know *why*, you could assume that it attacked them as they force entered the house = THAT doesn't mean that the guy purposely sent the dog to attack the police.

They think that someone that injuried someone is a risk and a danger. - Probably true, but then again, THAT is no excuse to shoot him AFTER the crime has been perpetrated. Even worse is that, they were "special" police officers that were sent to arrest him, and they figure out that a controller was a LETHAL weapon.

Sure, the dude is an ass for stealing TWO PS3s, but that's one AWFUL arresting procedure. And yes we are not saying he is inocent, but seriously, this isn't a darwing award, at least not for the robber.

Fuck.him. And who said anything about "punishment"? This was not a sentence handed to him. It was just an outcome. And caused by his own stupidity. Put yourself in the cops position. Do you want to get shot by some lowlife? The guy sends a dog, then he was probably hanging around with something in his hand, it was a controller. In a split second, what would you do?

He did something stupid, yeah, but it only deserved an arrest and a procedure, not DEATH. If he had robbed the PS3s, with a GUN, then I would be on the side of the cops, because they would have some idea that the subject was armed, but they didn't.

sweener2001 · Post by **sweener2001** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:20 am

Echoecho wrote:
Demios wrote:
Echoecho wrote:I don't know but if that was the guy who stole the stuff he got what he deserved so fuck him.
So the punishment for stealing is death? look I understand he assaulted someone. Death? I'm sorry but you are a fucking fool. No one deserves death unless their crimes are grave enough (rapists and murderers IMHO).
I'm a fucking fool yet you are arguing in favor of this guy without knowing the details? Were you there?

Here is what we know here.

The guy and his buddy beat someone up to steal expensive stuff.
The guy didn't answer his door when the police arrived.
The guy had a dangerous dog and allowed it to attack police.

Fuck.him. And who said anything about "punishment"? This was not a sentence handed to him. It was just an outcome. And caused by his own stupidity. Put yourself in the cops position. Do you want to get shot by some lowlife? The guy sends a dog, then he was probably hanging around with something in his hand, it was a controller. In a split second, what would you do?

I believe knowing you could be gunned down after stealing a console would stop some people, but it would also cause some people to wear bulletproof vests when stealing it and also make them carry guns to defend from the police chasing them. This is called escalation. The police wear bullet-proof vests, they buy armor-piercing rounds... Sure not any robber would do this. But nowadays you are threathened with a fist and a hit in your face if you don't give up your wallet. Do you like the thought of being threatened with a gun instead?
Plain dumb. People are robbed at gunpoint all the time.

what you or anyone here would do is a very different thing from what a police officer would do.

they're trained to handle this sort of thing. a controller does not look like a gun the last time i checked. and light guns haven't been popular for a very long time.

Deathlike2 · Post by **Deathlike2** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:28 am

Joe Camacho wrote:And I wonder Echoecho, WHERE YOU THERE?

Your "Points":
The guy and his buddy beat someone up to steal expensive stuff. Sure, that's a crime, and he should be processed by it, by a judge and a jury, and serve his sentence, NOT GET SHOT DOWN BY POLICE OFFICERS THAT THINK THAT A CONTROLLER IS A LETHAL WEAPON.

The guy didn't answer his door when the police arrived. Maybe he was taking a dump, or answering a phone call, hell, maybe he was trying to ace hole 18! So if someone knocks on your door and you don't open inmediately, it means that you can force entry and kill you? Fuck that. And we also ignore if they *told* the guy that they were the Police, they could have told him they had free pie for him, for all we know. Also, he had a ROOMMATE, couldn't he expected HE to open the door?

The guy had a dangerous dog and allowed it to attack police. A German Sheperd is a "dangerous dog" According to who? Also, we don't know if he really "allowed" it to attack. And even if he did, you don't KILL someone for damages caused by your pets.

What we DO know about the article is:

They shot the dog down. - We don't know *why*, you could assume that it attacked them as they force entered the house = THAT doesn't mean that the guy purposely sent the dog to attack the police.

They think that someone that injuried someone is a risk and a danger. - Probably true, but then again, THAT is no excuse to shoot him AFTER the crime has been perpetrated. Even worse is that, they were "special" police officers that were sent to arrest him, and they figure out that a controller was a LETHAL weapon.

Sure, the dude is an ass for stealing TWO PS3s, but that's one AWFUL arresting procedure. And yes we are not saying he is inocent, but seriously, this isn't a darwing award, at least not for the robber.

Fuck.him. And who said anything about "punishment"? This was not a sentence handed to him. It was just an outcome. And caused by his own stupidity. Put yourself in the cops position. Do you want to get shot by some lowlife? The guy sends a dog, then he was probably hanging around with something in his hand, it was a controller. In a split second, what would you do?
He did something stupid, yeah, but it only deserved an arrest and a procedure, not DEATH. If he had robbed the PS3s, with a GUN, then I would be on the side of the cops, because they would have some idea that the subject was armed, but they didn't.

This is a case where excessive force or police brutality actually applies. You are not supposed to pull out a gun unless shown one to begin with.

PHoNyMiKe · Post by **PHoNyMiKe** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 4:41 am

Demios wrote:patriotact.jpg

lmao

so wrong... so wrong.

Echoecho · Post by **Echoecho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 5:46 am

Joe Camacho wrote:And I wonder Echoecho, WHERE YOU THERE?

Did I say I was? I was refuting Deimos and his statement that his death was punishment for stealing. All I did was present what is known as per the news story and a different possibility from that.

And none of us was there, keep that in mind before saying you know how exactly things took place, or you'll look stupid. So it's not necessary for me to defend my conjecture from yours. Maybe this, maybe that. Maybe it was dark and he was slow and didn't comply when he had the controller in hand.

And yes, a German shepherd is a dangerous dog. I can't imagine the police would feel the need to shoot a chihuahua or a toy poodle. Nor would I imagine someone who is into aggravated robbery to have them.

what you or anyone here would do is a very different thing from what a police officer would do.

Yes but I know they are trained to act with proportionality. it was a hostile situation after the dog attacked and it's reasonable to see how they would be prepared for more.

Joe Camacho · Post by **Joe Camacho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:17 am

Echoecho wrote:
Joe Camacho wrote:And I wonder Echoecho, WHERE YOU THERE?
Did I say I was? I was refuting Deimos and his statement that his death was punishment for stealing. All I did was present what is known as per the news story and a different possibility from that.

And none of us was there, keep that in mind before saying you know how exactly things took place, or you'll look stupid. So it's not necessary for me to defend my conjecture from yours. Maybe this, maybe that. Maybe it was dark and he was slow and didn't comply when he had the controller in hand.

And yes, a German shepherd is a dangerous dog. I can't imagine the police would feel the need to shoot a chihuahua or a toy poodle. Nor would I imagine someone who is into aggravated robbery to have them.

what you or anyone here would do is a very different thing from what a police officer would do.
Yes but I know they are trained to act with proportionality. it was a hostile situation after the dog attacked and it's reasonable to see how they would be prepared for more.

Could you please highlight me the part in which the dog attacked, and not just attacked, it attacked according to the wishes of the owner.

Again, when an animal or pet that you own attacks another person, you usually get fined, not shot to death. For all the animal knows, a bunch of strangers got into the house and he did what dogs do, attack the strangers entering the house.

Echoecho · Post by **Echoecho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:23 am

Joe Camacho wrote:Could you please highlight me the part in which the dog attacked, and not just attacked, it attacked according to the wishes of the owner.

Again, when an animal or pet that you own attacks another person, you usually get fined, not shot to death. For all the animal knows, a bunch of strangers got into the house and he did what dogs do, attack the strangers entering the house.

Read my previous message.

None of us here know for certain if the dog attacked by his owner's command or not. All we know is that it's a reasonable likelihood. And stop with the arguing against stuff I never said.
=
Oh and another thing. To those assuming it has to be a gun in hand for the police to draw weapons. You are flat out wrong. It can be any "deadly weapon". And stop with the "a controller doesn't look like a weapon" stuff. Yes, it can in that circumstance. If I need to elaborate you are dumb.

Joe Camacho · Post by **Joe Camacho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:39 am

Echoecho wrote:
Joe Camacho wrote:Could you please highlight me the part in which the dog attacked, and not just attacked, it attacked according to the wishes of the owner.

Again, when an animal or pet that you own attacks another person, you usually get fined, not shot to death. For all the animal knows, a bunch of strangers got into the house and he did what dogs do, attack the strangers entering the house.
Read my previous message.

None of us here know for certain if the dog attacked by his owner's command or not. All we know is that it's a reasonable likelihood. And stop with the arguing against stuff I never said.
=
Oh and another thing. To those assuming it has to be a gun in hand for the police to draw weapons. You are flat out wrong. It can be any "deadly weapon". And stop with the "a controller doesn't look like a weapon" stuff. Yes, it can in that circumstance. If I need to elaborate you are dumb.

Ejm.. You typed:

Echoecho wrote:The guy and his buddy beat someone up to steal expensive stuff.
The guy didn't answer his door when the police arrived.
The guy had a dangerous dog and allowed it to attack police.

Please tell me, where in the article does it say that he "allowed" the dog to attack?

So you are seriously going to tell me that because a Dog doesn't freeze on command from his owner, he "allowed" the dog to attack the police, for fucks sakes. And in the same time, not only shoot the DOG, shoot the MAN too?

Draw your weapon =/= SHOOT TO KILL. You can draw to intimidate, you can draw to shoot to the air. If you are going to use Lethal force, you must make sure the AGGRESSOR can also deal deadly force.

Ok, so "any deadly weapon". Can you seriously back up your claim of the controller as a deadly weapon? This is too good to be true. But please, we are too dumb, in WHICH way can you kill someone with a PS3 controller, and I mean, in a Lethal way? Because I could hit you with a PS3 on your head for a couple of hours, that doesn't make it lethal.

Deathlike2 · Post by **Deathlike2** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 6:49 am

Joe Camacho wrote:Ok, so "any deadly weapon". Can you seriously back up your claim of the controller as a deadly weapon? This is too good to be true. But please, we are too dumb, in WHICH way can you kill someone with a PS3 controller, and I mean, in a Lethal way? Because I could hit you with a PS3 on your head for a couple of hours, that doesn't make it lethal.

This visual is amusing. Joe, you don't have to entertain his stupidity. It is self evident.

Echoecho · Post by **Echoecho** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 7:01 am

Joe Camacho wrote:Please tell me, where in the article does it say that he "allowed" the dog to attack?

Stop and don't embarrass yourself. I know what I typed. The article says the dog was shot, so unless you believe they shot a napping dog, it attacked. And the very act of having the dog makes you responsible for it's actions or lack of control. If you are not ready to take responsibility for the risks of having a dangerous dog and violent theft, don't make them yours.

So you are seriously going to tell me that because a Dog doesn't freeze on command from his owner, he "allowed" the dog to attack the police, for fucks sakes. And in the same time, not only shoot the DOG, shoot the MAN too?

The dog was shot, and he was mistakingly shot. But it was his own fault. If we go by what the police state, he is the one responsible, not the police since according to them, it was an honest mistake. It is mentioned that "officers considered the arrest a high-risk situation".

Ok, so "any deadly weapon". Can you seriously back up your claim of the controller as a deadly weapon? This is too good to be true. But please, we are too dumb, in WHICH way can you kill someone with a PS3 controller, and I mean, in a Lethal way? Because I could hit you with a PS3 on your head for a couple of hours, that doesn't make it lethal.

Did I ever say a PS3 controller is a deadly weapon? Yes, they can back that up. And also, please make some schematics and a presentation of the exact circumstance. Lighting, visibility, reaction of the suspect, timing, etc. With that said, I could kill or maim someone with a booby trap in my home with the flip of a control for one. I could spray them, blow them up. The possibilities are endless. And again keep in mind "officers considered the arrest a high-risk situation". And like I've said several times already: for all we know, it might have been dark and what's to say what looks like a gun or not?

darkbenny · Post by **darkbenny** » Wed Dec 06, 2006 7:05 am

Echoecho wrote:
Did I ever say a PS3 controller is a deadly weapon? Yes, they can back that up. And also, please make some schematics and a presentation of the exact circumstance. Lighting, visibility, reaction of the suspect, timing, etc. With that said, I could kill or maim someone with a booby trap in my home with the flip of a control for one. I could spray them, blow them up.

lol

wow man

you talk too much