Has anyone tried to modify ZSNES with a better sound core?

[the_ally235]

I mean, I'm just sayin' that this should be done, as it is as close to a better sound core for a ZSNES release as we're going to get, as 1.53 won't be seeing the light of the day soon, and 2.0 is pretty much like a myth at this point. Oh yeah, I'm new here, BUT I have been using this emulator for a long time, and I have always wanted to see it with a better sound core, so I just wanted to see if anyone has ever bothered with this task.

p.s. On an unrelated note, you can find me at starmen.net forums. I made the Radiation's EarthBound Halloween Hack Redone, of which my custom title screen I put in it was featured in a MatPat (The Game Theorists) video only a few days after I initially released the thing. My starmen account (will list in my sig later) can be found here.

[Gil_Hamilton]

Why not just use a better emulator? You know, so you get emulation improvements on all fronts instead of just sound.

[the_ally235]

Umm...
I really like ZSNES, and I only have a tick with its sound core. Everything else is fine.

[Agozer]

Everything else is fine.

No, everything else is not really fine at all. Just because you can't see the issues clearly, doesn't mean that they aren't there.

Just use something like Snes9x or Higan for now, you'll be much happier.

[the_ally235]

I could tell with that as well. And I do sometimes use Snes9x, but the thing that bothers me with that is having to get the cheats from one rom over to another for that emulator. And some things that it has on it bothers me sometimes. Also, if someone modified ZSNES to support 8 MB roms now, can't we just have someone change its sound core so the sound isn't so... weird...

Eh, but I guess we'll just have to wait for the official release of v1.53 or whatever.

[Gil_Hamilton]

I could tell with that as well. And I do sometimes use Snes9x, but the thing that bothers me with that is having to get the cheats from one rom over to another for that emulator. And some things that it has on it bothers me sometimes. Also, if someone modified ZSNES to support 8 MB roms now, can't we just have someone change its sound core so the sound isn't so... weird...

Eh, but I guess we'll just have to wait for the official release of v1.53 or whatever.

Be nice if someone modified it to have something resembling accurate timing, too. And to block illegal VRAM writes. And to... etc etc

[nintendo_nerd]

There's always that version of Snes9x that uses a Libretro code with a Zsnes GUI, called ZMZ I think.

[epman6]

I could tell with that as well. And I do sometimes use Snes9x, but the thing that bothers me with that is having to get the cheats from one rom over to another for that emulator. And some things that it has on it bothers me sometimes. Also, if someone modified ZSNES to support 8 MB roms now, can't we just have someone change its sound core so the sound isn't so... weird...

Eh, but I guess we'll just have to wait for the official release of v1.53 or whatever.

there's a special FuSoYa version of ZSNES from his web site that supports 8Mb snes roms (released Dec. 25, 2015). I use that version of zsnes on most of my Windows PCs instead of the normal zsnes versions.

[Gil_Hamilton]

I could tell with that as well. And I do sometimes use Snes9x, but the thing that bothers me with that is having to get the cheats from one rom over to another for that emulator. And some things that it has on it bothers me sometimes. Also, if someone modified ZSNES to support 8 MB roms now, can't we just have someone change its sound core so the sound isn't so... weird...

Eh, but I guess we'll just have to wait for the official release of v1.53 or whatever.

there's a special FuSoYa version of ZSNES from his web site that supports 8Mb snes roms (released Dec. 25, 2015). I use that version of zsnes on most of my Windows PCs instead of the normal zsnes versions.

Hooray for propping up glitchy emulators and encouraging their use in new software development!

[blackmyst]

It's like Nesticle in 2016. The more things change, the more they stay the same...

[paulguy]

The SMW ROM hacking community has quite a bit of legacy cruft, including specific hacks but also tools that people probably still use, which depends on zsnes.

[Gil_Hamilton]

The SMW ROM hacking community has quite a bit of legacy cruft, including specific hacks but also tools that people probably still use, which depends on zsnes.

And attempts to wean people off them and migrate them to doing things that actually work on a Super Nintendo just result in a lot of bitching about how ZSNES is the better emulator and everyone is a bunch of self-important haters.

[joe_devore]

I love ZSNES ^_^ and will always prefer it..
I don't really like SNES9x much...

[nintendo_nerd]

I love ZSNES ^_^ and will always prefer it..
I don't really like SNES9x much...

Try ZMZ, it Snes9x with the Zsnes GUI, using Libretro cores, so it's the best of both worlds; Zsnes has horrendously inaccurate S-SMP emulation ><
http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&t=67700

You can't even play Earthworm Jim 2 on Zsnes with full sound effects lol.

[blackmyst]

The SMW ROM hacking community has quite a bit of legacy cruft, including specific hacks but also tools that people probably still use, which depends on zsnes.

And attempts to wean people off them and migrate them to doing things that actually work on a Super Nintendo just result in a lot of bitching about how ZSNES is the better emulator and everyone is a bunch of self-important haters.

I stand corrected, it's worse than nesticle ever was.

[nintendo_nerd]

The SMW ROM hacking community has quite a bit of legacy cruft, including specific hacks but also tools that people probably still use, which depends on zsnes.

And attempts to wean people off them and migrate them to doing things that actually work on a Super Nintendo just result in a lot of bitching about how ZSNES is the better emulator and everyone is a bunch of self-important haters.

I stand corrected, it's worse than nesticle ever was.

That's one helluva accomplishment, and yeah, for a while, people on ROM hacking sites got all defensive because I compared Zsnes to Snes9x and Higan.

[kode54]

Someone should totally take that ZSNES hack and publish it into some ROM hacks of actual games, and have it only trigger in ZSNES.

[Stillmatic]

Try ZMZ, it Snes9x with the Zsnes GUI, using Libretro cores, so it's the best of both worlds; Zsnes has horrendously inaccurate S-SMP emulation ><
http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&t=67700

You can't even play Earthworm Jim 2 on Zsnes with full sound effects lol.

I've read a lot of people saying that Snes9x has bad input lag, I don't know if there is any truth to that. They say Super Mario World suffers badly with lag that you notice even more if you've ever played the game on a real snes.

[nintendo_nerd]

Try ZMZ, it Snes9x with the Zsnes GUI, using Libretro cores, so it's the best of both worlds; Zsnes has horrendously inaccurate S-SMP emulation ><
http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=viewthread&t=67700

You can't even play Earthworm Jim 2 on Zsnes with full sound effects lol.

I've read a lot of people saying that Snes9x has bad input lag, I don't know if there is any truth to that. They say Super Mario World suffers badly with lag that you notice even more if you've ever played the game on a real snes.

I personally never had that issue, I use an Xbox 360 controller without any issues, be that as it may, the amount is negligible. Snes9x shares the same S-SMP core Bsnes/Higan uses, which was programmed by Blargg, it's very accurate and spot on to the real machine IMHO. Oddly enough, injecting Earthworm Jim 2 into a Wii U virtual console ROM has the same issues as Zsnes, missing sound effects.

[Stillmatic]

I personally never had that issue, I use an Xbox 360 controller without any issues, be that as it may, the amount is negligible. Snes9x shares the same S-SMP core Bsnes/Higan uses, which was programmed by Blargg, it's very accurate and spot on to the real machine IMHO. Oddly enough, injecting Earthworm Jim 2 into a Wii U virtual console ROM has the same issues as Zsnes, missing sound effects.

Good to hear. Do you prefer using an Xbox 360 controller over a snes joypad? Do you think the snes pad would cause lag? So you can't see any difference between Snes9x and zsnes in regards to lag, btw I presume you have played SMW on a real snes?

The only game I've tried on zsnes is Super Probotector and I did notice some of the sound effects being off. I've owned the Earthworm Jim games since they were first released but I don't remember the second one other then it having a bit of Beethoven music lol.

[nintendo_nerd]

I personally never had that issue, I use an Xbox 360 controller without any issues, be that as it may, the amount is negligible. Snes9x shares the same S-SMP core Bsnes/Higan uses, which was programmed by Blargg, it's very accurate and spot on to the real machine IMHO. Oddly enough, injecting Earthworm Jim 2 into a Wii U virtual console ROM has the same issues as Zsnes, missing sound effects.

Good to hear. Do you prefer using an Xbox 360 controller over a snes joypad? Do you think the snes pad would cause lag? So you can't see any difference between Snes9x and zsnes in regards to lag, btw I presume you have played SMW on a real snes?

The only game I've tried on zsnes is Super Probotector and I did notice some of the sound effects being off. I've owned the Earthworm Jim games since they were first released but I don't remember the second one other then it having a bit of Beethoven music lol.

Not for a very long time, most my Snes games' batteries died out and I can't be arsed to order more and install them myself, too much trouble. There might be lag, but it's so minuscule to not make any difference. Snes9x isn't as bad as people say it is, and actually runs games at their properly-timed speeds, esp special chip games. I can't go back to Zsnes, the inaccurate audio is just...painful. Xbox 360 controller works fine.

[grinvader]

To answer the original question: Yes, we tried.
It didn't go as nicely as expected.
Tracking the causes led to the choice of rebuilding from scratch, and a minor peak in brain bleach stocks.

We got a build that output really good audio to a file. Cough. That was before other emus switched to blargg's core, btw.

[Cammygirl192]

About the input lag discussion:

I notice it in the NTSC version of Super Mario Kart on Snes9x, and I use a keyboard to play (since PS3 controllers aren't natively supported by Windows, and I haven't bought an Xbox to USB cable yet). However in ZSNES, I barely noticed any input lag and generally have better Time Trial times in that emulator, so the input lag issue in Snes9x seriously needs to be addressed.

However discussing the issue here and not on the Snes9x forum isn't going to do much tbh. How many of you people are on the Snes9x forums, before I come and register there...

[Gil_Hamilton]

About the input lag discussion:

I notice it in the NTSC version of Super Mario Kart on Snes9x, and I use a keyboard to play (since PS3 controllers aren't natively supported by Windows, and I haven't bought an Xbox to USB cable yet). However in ZSNES, I barely noticed any input lag and generally have better Time Trial times in that emulator, so the input lag issue in Snes9x seriously needs to be addressed.

A comparison between two emulators is not useful, especially when one is known to have significant errors in timing.


This leads to people filing bug reports because Star Fox plays choppy and Bomberman runs slowly in multiplayer, when in actuality said games were behaving as on a real system and the "right" behavior according to the bug report was actually very wrong. Those are real examples I've personally witnessed, not hypothetical scenarios.




Lag is also a very difficult thing to measure accurately, in part because your brain lies to you about reality and is hardwired to hide lag-like issues from your perception. So I am always skeptical of lag claims.

[nintendo_nerd]

About the input lag discussion:

I notice it in the NTSC version of Super Mario Kart on Snes9x, and I use a keyboard to play (since PS3 controllers aren't natively supported by Windows, and I haven't bought an Xbox to USB cable yet). However in ZSNES, I barely noticed any input lag and generally have better Time Trial times in that emulator, so the input lag issue in Snes9x seriously needs to be addressed.

However discussing the issue here and not on the Snes9x forum isn't going to do much tbh. How many of you people are on the Snes9x forums, before I come and register there...

Did you even try Snes9x 1.54? It slaughters Zsnes in the timing department.